who want's the dragons to return?

[dr drako dragon]

i have always wanted to see a dragon why can't they be here now?!?!?!?!?

[Falconer]

You got a problem with the lack of dragons, go talk to the misguided knights who killed most of them off in the early middle ages.

[Blue Tiger]

well, again this is a very debated subjetc. The subject of whether they existed or not. Im sticking with the belief that they do exist, just not on this plane, if that makes sense. They exist in a different dimension/world, of which there are many. Perhaps they had been here at some stage, but how could they come back or stay here now anyway? with the earth full to burstin g with humans, humans with limited undersatnds, humans with a great ability to jump to conclusions, humans who are easily scared and sent into panic, humans who have severe weaponry?

[Corva]

Try looking in the Garden of Eden, a.k.a the garden of the Hespridies. Be warned, it will try to kill you and likely succeed. Assuming it doesn't, then you're immortal. Do you want to push your luck? For a safer option, try looking elsewhere. The sea sounds like a good place.

I think they're here, just... not revealing themselves. Im starting to lean further and further towards Draconic_Chroniclers view.

[alondor]

explain this cronicler view please other wise I think dragons will show themselves when they are readyand believe humans to be so as well

[Corva]

Draconic_Chronicler was a member here a while back, who was writing a book claiming that Dragons were actually the Seraphim of Judeo-Christianity. Then there's the Nephilim to deal with...

Hence my comment about the garden on Eden, because a Seraphim is gaurding the Tree of Life.

[Blue Tiger]

DragonRider, do you know if he completed that book???

[Corva]

No. He had some kind of argument with manofthewolf (which was very one sided; I recall it was mainly manofthewolf writing 'My gods are better than your god', or something of that nature), then left.

[Makla]

whether or not they exist now, there is plenty of evidance suggesting they did at one time. civilizations with no way of communicating all 'accidentally' invented these creatures for their lore? i highly doubt. I'm not one for extreme conicidences. the aztecs, the english, mayans, greek. they all had dragons in their mythology before they encountered one another

[alondor]

You failed to mention the chinese and japanese both of which were isolated for a really long time

[Drakel]

well, again this is a very debated subjetc. The subject of whether they existed or not. Im sticking with the belief that they do exist, just not on this plane, if that makes sense. They exist in a different dimension/world, of which there are many. Perhaps they had been here at some stage, but how could they come back or stay here now anyway? with the earth full to burstin g with humans, humans with limited undersatnds, humans with a great ability to jump to conclusions, humans who are easily scared and sent into panic, humans who have severe weaponry?

so wait you are saying Dragons are aliens LOL hahahhaha not posable. I am not saying there is other life in space but dragons were made here biologicly. the chance of them being on another living planet would be 1/10000000000000000 so yes it is not as posible as you think. Also yes we wiped out dragons long ago but we were afrade. Realy if you were in that time seeing a fire breathing monsture would you be scared. I don't know how to ansure that question and I know you can't! But now times have changed we are trying to keep what is left alive with all costs. But if dragons still exsist than we have a good chance to try and keep it alive by giving it all its needs. In this time that is all we want. but the more times age the more we will pay for our sins of killing off more than half of our world. Douse that mean we can't fix it? Agin I could not ansure. But I think the world would love our expertese of the subject.

[Drakel]

Try looking in the Garden of Eden, a.k.a the garden of the Hespridies. Be warned, it will try to kill you and likely succeed. Assuming it doesn't, then you're immortal. Do you want to push your luck? For a safer option, try looking elsewhere. The sea sounds like a good place.

I think they're here, just... not revealing themselves. Im starting to lean further and further towards Draconic_Chroniclers view.

The the Garden of Eden has bin lost to humanity for way more that 50000 years. Also douse it say it is a dragon that guards the garden. NO! it douse not. it ses a snake guards the garden after G-- punished the snake to walk on its stumic.

[Drakel]

whether or not they exist now, there is plenty of evidance suggesting they did at one time. civilizations with no way of communicating all 'accidentally' invented these creatures for their lore? i highly doubt. I'm not one for extreme conicidences. the aztecs, the english, mayans, greek. they all had dragons in their mythology before they encountered one another

finaly some1 who knows the facts about dragons. FINALY FOUND A PERSON TO TALK TO THAT HAS THE SAME IDEAS AS ME

[Blue Tiger]

well, again this is a very debated subjetc. The subject of whether they existed or not. Im sticking with the belief that they do exist, just not on this plane, if that makes sense. They exist in a different dimension/world, of which there are many. Perhaps they had been here at some stage, but how could they come back or stay here now anyway? with the earth full to burstin g with humans, humans with limited undersatnds, humans with a great ability to jump to conclusions, humans who are easily scared and sent into panic, humans who have severe weaponry?

so wait you are saying Dragons are aliens LOL hahahhaha not posable. I am not saying there is other life in space but dragons were made here biologicly. the chance of them being on another living planet would be 1/10000000000000000 so yes it is not as posible as you think. Also yes we wiped out dragons long ago but we were afrade. Realy if you were in that time seeing a fire breathing monsture would you be scared. I don't know how to ansure that question and I know you can't! But now times have changed we are trying to keep what is left alive with all costs. But if dragons still exsist than we have a good chance to try and keep it alive by giving it all its needs. In this time that is all we want. but the more times age the more we will pay for our sins of killing off more than half of our world. Douse that mean we can't fix it? Agin I could not ansure. But I think the world would love our expertese of the subject.

Excuse me, I said PLANE not PLANET. I didnt say they were aliens, there are different planes of existance, parallel dimensions, still part of this world, connected but not. Google it, I cant really explain it. But dragons may have used magic to escape this world and live in the planes that they originally came from.

And by the way, dont double and triple post, its annoying, and looks lonely, lol.

[Drakel]

Ok so now you we are talking about a wormhole thrue our planet witch will that would bring dragons. You do know a warm hole might not work on earth for if something frome 1 plane of exsitence comes to another and makes conact would mean total anialation. So if dragons did come frome another plaine of exsitance would mean we all would be dead and our plane of exsistance would fall apart. Also a wormhole on our planet at that time would me a far less chance to let out dragons. Sould I do the math of that typ of chance lol

Like I sed! I think Dragons wher made on earth/ this plain of exsistance. And nowere but earth/ this plain of exsistance. chace of my statement is the same chance on humanity on earth on the same time. VERY VERY high!

Also I would like to add that you sed plane/ planet.

ps. Why is it when ppl don't know what to say next (about dragons)! They always say MAGIC lol. you want me to beleve your posts plz use logic, science and history to help your facts. Not magic! Unless you can prove to me that magic is any of the three subjects up there it is and will be a USELESS word!

[Falconer]

Also douse it say it is a dragon that guards the garden. NO! it douse not. it ses a snake guards the garden after G-- punished the snake to walk on its stumic.

Actually, both of those are wrong.

So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

Ok so now you we are talking about a warm hole thrue our planet witch will that would bring dragons. You do know a warm hole might not work on earth for if something frome 1 plane of exsitence comes to another and makes conact would mean total anialation.

I think you meant "wormhole". A "warm hole" is... something best left out of a G-rated forum.
Wormholes are supramolecular tunnels linking two locations in time and space within a universe. To date, there is no solid evidence that they can link to parallel universes. As to higher planes of existence, those are metaphysical only and do not relate to any part of physics. The total annihilation thing is onyl possible if said dragons were made of antimatter, which is possible; simulations as to the potential existence of organized antimatter are inconclusive.

Like I sed! I think Dragons wher made on earth/ this plain of exsistance. And nowere but earth/ this plain of exsistance. chace of my statement is the same chance on humanity on earth on the same time. VERY VERY high!

Laying aside the aforementioned plane of existence issue, you seem to have missed something. While I agree that yes, I think dragons were here, on this planet, it's impossible to make a definitive statement as to their presence on other worlds, assuming said worlds existed.
Also, the odds of humanity evolving on Earth at 1 in 10^40,000. Which isn't very likely, and is probably a poor analogy.

ps. Why is it when ppl don't know what to say next (about dragons)! They always say MAGIC lol. you want me to beleve your posts plz use logic, science and history to help your facts. Not magic! Unless you can prove to me that magic is any of the three subjects up there it is and will be a USELESS word!

There was no magic in Blue Tiger's explanation. Some dubious phrasing, perhaps, but the explanation itself did not purport to be a scientific one:

Im sticking with the belief that they do exist, just not on this plane

This is not a scientific answer. The concept of a higher/different plane of existence is religious in origin and nature. This is therefore a religious belief, and as such debating it is restricted under board rules.

Just to be clear, though, I don't particularly believe in magic either.

[Drakel]

But dragons may have used magic to escape this world and live in the planes that they originally came from

Yes blue did say magic in his statement!

also l ment was same time within knolege of humanity.

I know my spelling is a lil bad but spelling isn't easy on some words.

[vampirehunter42]

(don't worry too much about the spelling. Just try to double check your works and you will learn to find the mistakes. Take this from a fellow bad speller.)

One main problem with using science with explaining dragons is the main legend we have about them are from people with little to no knowledge in science. Yes people like Pliny the Elder wrote about 'dragons' in their studies. But most of these are very vague.

We need to try not to go.
'A fish has scales and swims in the water,
This snake has scales and swims in the water

so this snake must be a fish.'

And that seems to be the problem with 'dragon' sightings. If something is close enough to what we know as a dragon, we call it a dragon.

[Drakel]

One main problem with using science with explaining dragons is the main legend we have about them are from people with little to no knowledge in science. Yes people like Pliny the Elder wrote about 'dragons' in their studies. But most of these are very vague.

We need to try not to go.
'A fish has scales and swims in the water,
This snake has scales and swims in the water

so this snake must be a fish.'

And that seems to be the problem with 'dragon' sightings. If something is close enough to what we know as a dragon, we call it a dragon.

ok I see were you are going with this but I also don't get the point lol!

ps. you can tell me and blue are not getting a good start!lol

[Blue Tiger]

Dont worry dragonmaster. We are fine. I was just coming up with ONE idea, and the plane idea is not my own, I have it on a source from a reliable friend, and I will not ellaborate more. The belief in magic is up to you, I cant prove its there or that its not there. In a lot of legends, dragons and magic just go together. Dragons in chinese legend can shrink to something the size of a worm, then grow to the size of a mountain, for what ever purposes, so says some legends.
The planes of existance theory, well, I wouldnt say that it came from a religious background, because im not talking about heaven and hell. Im not actually sure where they came from, but there is the belief of planes of existance in Wicca and Shamanism. They are also called Astral Planes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astral_plane
http://www.google.ie/search?hl=en&sourc ... anes+of+ex Start researching from there, lol!

And anyway, if you want scientific, well, i can come up with a load scientific stuff for dragons. But before I start with a few, remember this: Some things cant be explained, and when dragons are concerned, magic can be the answer.
Ok, if dragons existed, where are all their bones? I hate this one, but its true enough to consider. We have dinosaur fossils etc etc blady blady blah, you get the jist. When i was asked this question, I said that perhaps, when dragons were about to die, maybe they would throw them selves into volcanoes, or got other dragons to throw their bodies in, so there is no evidence of their existance. i think I was 15 when I came up with that answer, lol! Someone here, possibly Silv, or maybe even you Falconer, said that they may eat each other, as a clean up method, I didnt particularly like this theory, but its possible!
Then the argument comes up again with this statement at the front: Dragons are in cultures all over the world, separated communities, 1000s of years apart, all have legends of dragons so they must have been real. I dont want to get into this one, cus I know people have lots of theories for and against, but lets just say that it is a point, but one that can be explained to some extent. I personally think its a good statement, but to believe that it deffinately proves that dragons were here, well, I dont know, it just goes back to the fossil thing again doesnt it?

Circles, everything is in circles. We go one way, we come back again, and its all because there are no solid facts....... And also that each of us have our own oppinions and sources.

One more thing, if dragons were here and they WERE NOT wiped out, then you must believe that they went into hiding. Now, with humans all over the place, there are only a limited amount of places they can hide in that would be totally isolated. Places like the poles, etc etc. But still, they would have to be pretty good hiding places, the dragons still need to eat/ hutn and mate, and would they be able to do all this without being spotted once? By chance? By someone?

Just thought of something, maybe they all got frozen in glaciers? But then again, we dont know for sure the likely times they existed. Was it during the dinosaurs times? As well as being around when knights were? Knights wiped them out, thats another theory. And I dont want to got into that either.

Thats me done on scientific stuff.

Let me quote some stuff from Ciruelo's "Book of the Dragon"
The dragons heritage. Dragons guard special shining stones. Known as Lapis draconiensis aurulucentis, these stones have a natural phosphorescence... These stones are sacred to dragons... they are a symbol of their identities... Tradition has it that the stones come from a remote and wondeful place known as the Shining World, where the Ancestor Dragons still live. In the distant past, some members of the dragon species were expelled from this world by the great dragon as a punishment for trying to change nature to suit themselves without respecting ecological balance or life forces. They were allowed, however, to keep just a few shiny stones as a reminder of their homeland and their glorius past. This explains the dragons deep respect for nature and the care taken not to disturb ecological balance when practising magic. Dragons believe that if they striclty observe dragon ethics throughout their lives, they will at last be able to return to the wondrous Shining World to join the Great Dragon, and be reunited with those who were not condemned to roam the Earth.

Now, that goes back to the planes existance, and I read this in the book long after I was allready told about planes of existance. So it was a nice surprise to get another source.
Theres other stuff in this book, about legends of dragons being slayed in different places, with the names of the dragons, and those who slayed them, and they are well known legends in the places they are from.
Anway, my fingers are about to fall off, lol...

[Drakel]

And anyway, if you want scientific, well, i can come up with a load scientific stuff for dragons

ok 1 you got me all wrong. I don't care mutch about science becouse sience sometimes is more wrong than we are. I only use science for ppl who are more errr... ummm...For ppl who douse not see hope in things like dragons unless you put far to mutch science in the matter. couse of these ppl it is impossible to win. But me, I am into the Loggic in things. I put loggic in all my posts. and it is eassy for me to explain with loggic than it is with science.

Ok, if dragons existed, where are all their bones? I hate this one, but its true enough to consider. We have dinosaur fossils etc etc blady blady blah, you get the jist. When i was asked this question, I said that perhaps, when dragons were about to die, maybe they would throw them selves into volcanoes, or got other dragons to throw their bodies in, so there is no evidence of their existance. i think I was 15 when I came up with that answer, lol! Someone here, possibly Silv, or maybe even you Falconer, said that they may eat each other, as a clean up method, I didnt particularly like this theory, but its possible!

kk I think dragons are not cannibles. It is kinda hard to immagen that a dragon eats a dragon. kinda like it is hard to think about y ppl eat ppl. yes there are ppl that eat ppl. But still! The bone thing I tryed to explain over and over agian. there is a 5% chance to fined Dragon bones. There is a 5% chance to dig up Trex bones, 5% chance for raptors, and so on! the only way we can realy fined dragon bones is if ppl look hard! also the only way to get all the bones in this world is to dig up this world. so realy there is a 50% chance there are dragons just like there was a 50% chance to get an undiscuvered dino.!
There is also anouther theary for ppl who gave up witch is seeing that ppl thout dragons are demons back then they could have burned the dragon bodys, and after that they would chush the bones to make sure the dragons will be gon forever.

Now, that goes back to the planes existance, and I read this in the book long after I was allready told about planes of existance. So it was a nice surprise to get another source.

like i sed it would be a 1 in a ... umm... (VERY VERY high number that i don't know) chance for this to happen.
but like you sed opinon is very lol.

And by the way, dont double and triple post, its annoying, and looks lonely, lol.

I would like to state that I am home school and my friends and girl friend are in normal school. So I don't see them untill like 5:00 pm and get to hang with them untill 11:00 pm. so I got free time to typ all day if I want. I also go thrue school like nothing so I get free time. (Live in US)

[Falconer]

That wasn't me on the cannibal idea, must have been Silv.

Dakes, where'd you get the 5% statistic? I can't find it anywhere.

[Drakel]

math and chance couse if you have a lil spot in the whole world you realy only have a 5% chance to get exactly what you want!

[Falconer]

Okay... so you figure that to be the odds of locating dragon bones? Cool.

Hey every, I'm heading out to go dig holes in twenty back yards, should find some dragon bones in one of them.

[Drakel]

umm you know home yards and parks are bolthe human made areas. means the chance of fineding any typ of bone would be .000000015%, witch would mean there is no hope at all. now if you dug in a highly nature spot like a forest or mountian that is far frome civilization would give you that 5% that you want. also location is a key. possibly a cave that was said to be a dragon's cave would be as bad as you want to get when looking for dragons. It is good place if you want a .0010% chance to fined dragon bones. I should know. I am trying to be an acheologist!